what is cisco telepresence ?

[amolathalye]

Hi all ,

I wanted to know the difference between our polycom codecs that we are currently using and the cisco telepresnece. How they are different ? does anybody know about them ? can they be used on isdn network ? for onsite events?

regards

amol

[bba01]

i am puzzled too.I need to know the difference between polycom codec and cisco telepresnece

[Tallman2]

I just went to Cisco for a presentation on there Telepresence... in short there unit is designed with custom furniture and lighting to give you the feeling that you are at the same table with people at the other location.
The system is 1080P looks outstanding...works over I.P. at 5M.

Two problems... there Multipoint and the ability to do a H.323 and H.320 mix calls are not avaiable yet.

Also the bigger problem I see is cost... est about $300,000.00

[11B-33T]

Impressive from the audience seats...smoke & mirrors IMHO. You're using three HDX 9000 series codecs in that setup and Tall is correct about the 'mere pittance' cost though that's probably not including the maintenance contract...

[Conquest_Tsi]

TP is fantastic, the room is setup perfectly and is a very very nice toy, runs about 20mb bandwidth i think. I have seen it in loopback mode, plasmas are huge and very very sharp display.

I was in awe of it, simple to use, ideal for execs.

but very expensive!! and at this point only point to point but with vendor interoperability and multipoint to come.

used on ISDN? what is this the 80s!

[Tallman2]

Conquest
I not suggesting to go to ISDN lines .... however a lot of sites still are ISDN only, so having the ability to do mixed calls is needed.

Bigger question is anybody using it or know of companies with TP

[Conquest_Tsi]

Conquest
I not suggesting to go to ISDN lines .... however a lot of sites still are ISDN only, so having the ability to do mixed calls is needed.

Bigger question is anybody using it or know of companies with TP

Ah ok, i dont think at this time there is ISDN-IP capability, it kinda negates the purpose of HD.

I know of quite a few companies here in Australia which are using them, mainly private enterprise eg: financial firms etc and some big IT contracting companies using some for display purposes.

[Tallman2]

Conquest
So do you tell some who has a Telepresence system that they can not call a end point (NON HD) with ISDN lines only because they are not HD??

Of course not this is just some flexability that needs to be addressed.

Until the world is all HD or on a H.323 network the is plenty of need for this. I can tell you I work for a military contractor and there are still more goverment sites that are H.320 only than there are H.323.

[Sean Lessman]

Ah ok, i dont think at this time there is ISDN-IP capability, it kinda negates the purpose of HD.

The TANDBERG Experia can bring standard H.323 systems into a telepresence call. This also means you can bring on H.320 (ISDN) sites through an H.323/H.320 gateway.

Sean

[Conquest_Tsi]

I work for a large Government Health Service in Australia, yes there are prob more ISDN sites then IP in the gov aus wide, we have recently converted/rolled out all our sites to IP, and yes we do have an ISDN gateway to communicate with ISDN.

I am just saying why spend 100's of thousands of $ on a CISCO teleprescene solution and then want to dial via ISDN?
From what i have heard companies are not just buying one, they are buying multiple rooms for their offices all over the country/world.

[emello]

The issue with a Cisco telepresence (much like the other Halo system by HP) is that it will only talk to another Cisco system.

Also, both systems require dedicated bandwidth - 10 Mbs and it is my understanding you can't do ad hoc calls but have to pre-schedule any event.

I think most of the part that appeals to execs is the fancy furniture. Put a few Tandbergs under the desks (much like what they're doing with their own systms) and no one would know, and you can connect to more people overall.

;)

[amolathalye]

Phew ! that's a lot of information. I also tried gathering some more info. on this and got to know that this is another kind of segment and all the players have their own telepresence systems such as HP Halo , Sony teleportal , Polycom etc. It's like having a rolls royce in cars. The expereince is great but has lots of limitations such as big bandwidth , extreme cost , no compatibility with other systems etc.

[Sean Lessman]

...(much like the other Halo system by HP) is that it will only talk to another Cisco system.

The HP Halo does have a gateway available that lets it talk to standards based systems and isn't limited to CIF and G.711 as the Cisco version is.

Sean

[emello]

Ah, I learned something new! Always good to have you about, Sean!

[nomad]

Well guys the company I am working for is evaluating it, we are currently using Tandberg and trying to steer them down the Experia root, any inputs you have Sean for advantages would be good!

[televideoguy]

I feel compelled to point out a couple of other details based on my experience with Cisco's version of telepresence:

1) The cameras are not hidden in the screens as they are with at least one other solution out there. I don't know about anyone else, but its difficult for me to buy into the illusion of really being at the table with the remote participants when there are multiple cameras directly in my face.
2) The picture settings were not matched between the screens, again adding to the breakdown of whatever illusion was being attempted.
3) The content sharing screen was very low and one had to crane one's neck over the table in order to view it - not optimal.
4) The high-def was nice, but I never experienced a moment where I was fooled at any level into thinking the remote participants were in the same room with me.

For my money, a decent HD system from one of the standard video vendors with good monitors, mics and speakers provides nearly the same effect for 10% of the cost, has more flexible connectivity options, and uses less bandwidth. I do think the concept is interesting and if a company has money to burn and the CEO wants to impress his/her friends with the new telepresence suite, by all means go for it. I'd love to have that problem.

[abouton]

Hello, some interesting information there.

I am trying to get a matrix with pros and cons regarding Cisco TP and Tandberg Experia.

To resume TP and as some people did it in the first post. Telepresence is a whole room with furniture and pre calibrated cameras giving the illusion of beeing a the same table as the far sites.

A lot of vendors offer the whole room and furniture with their system, other vendors just the table and the system and some others, offer the possibility to build a TP system out of simple codecs.

In the options to take into account we can count:
.total bandwidth required
.picture resolution and compression
.sound compression
.ability to connect to different brands and equipments
.IP/ISDN capabilities
.possibility to use for adhoc calls

is there somebody out there who has been doing the comparaison?
could you guve us the outcome?

thanks !!

[Tallman2]

I still think to biggest outcome will not be the equipment but the Cost. I know most companies are trying to go "Green" and save on travel however I just can not see it replacing HD VTC, some cases yes.

I work for a major defense contractor who has many VTC with the Pentagon and other defense contrators over some very large contracts and none of the has considered Telepresence and all are aware of the capabilities.

[Sean Lessman]

Well guys the company I am working for is evaluating it, we are currently using Tandberg and trying to steer them down the Experia root, any inputs you have Sean for advantages would be good!

The biggest differentiator that comes to mind is the approach to standards based VTC connections. We believe all calls should connect at the best experience regardless of standards VTC or telepresence -- and we deliver this. Cisco is happy with VCR quality video (352x288) and telephone quality audio.

You should check out the announcements on the new T1 Telepresence system powered by the C90 codec. Its a great new technology with an impressive lead over the competition.

Sean

[IC1sharp]

The TANDBERG Experia can bring standard H.323 systems into a telepresence call. This also means you can bring on H.320 (ISDN) sites through an H.323/H.320 gateway.

Sean

And it is packaged with AMX control with all the equipment hidden behind the screens out of site :bandit:
The Audio was outstanding too.

[ahung]

I have attended a Cisco Teleprescence and Tandberg Experia demo and in a few weeks will attend a Polycom demo. Some of our concerns with Cisco are:
* Limitation on video endpoints, only 4 different models.
* Dedicated VNOC (AT&T) for the 3000 series models, difficult to bridge in non-teleprescence
* Poor video quality while video with H.323 endpoint and Microsoft OCS
* Integration with CallManager, which we don't have
* Room integration and hardware cost

The 3000 series seems to be "egovision", the data sharing projection screen is placed at a awkward location so you have to sit up and stare down. For me I wasn't concern about the exposed camera, I'm used to it from using regular video endpoint but some of the newer models from Cisco, Tandberg, Polycom, etc are starting to hide the cams. When Cisco showed us a video call with a H.323 (a Tandberg 150 endpoint), they had an IT guy standing by to initiate the call for us, that was a good indication the product is not stable with H.323. The video and sound quality was very good while calling other Teleprescense.

The Tandberg demo showed us more features (that met our requirements) within the first 5-10 minutes of the demo then Cisco did in their 45 mins preso.